|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 11, 2021 20:23:32 GMT
Pricey country for Americans to travel. Scandinavia, at least. I suspect that the Baltics may well be different.
But, if I'm going to be there, I might as well fit in as much as possible. This leads me to daydream of Iceland, Norway and Denmark, as well as the Baltic states and St. Petersburg. I'd be interested in Poland and northern Germany, as well.
Of course, the folks I usually travel with, Grand Circle Cruises, has a limited selection of tours, none of which go to all my desired destinations. It looks like I may need to string three 'tours' together to get the entire swath of northern Europe included.
So, intrepid travelers, when is the best time for USers to travel the inner pond of Europe? I understand some/much of it freezes over during the winter. Still? I'm a cheapskate traveler, but this may be my last round (if I even manage escape velocity...), so I may try to do too much. It's looking like an Iceland tour, tacked on to a Norway tour, tacked on to the Baltic tour, but that last choice excludes Sweden, but includes Helsinki, where the alternate 'cruise' includes Sweden (twice) and excludes Finland. **sigh** Denmark gets included as an "add on" destination (for additional $$, of course)...
I'm guessing spring over autumn....when is 'too early', and when is 'too late'? I do not like, nor seek, 'tropical outlets'.
JoeP and Miisa? I expect you two could give me informed opinions.
My dream tour:
- Fly in to Reykjavik, spend several days touring the island - Fjord cruise from Narvik to Trondheim, to Bergen, to Oslo, and Gothenburg. - Baltic cruise/tour beginning in Copenhagen, Lubeck, Gdansk, Visby, Stockholm, Helsinki, St. Petersburg, Tallinn, Riga, Vilnius, and Klaipeda. - Berlin.
|
|
|
Post by Kye on Jan 11, 2021 21:16:56 GMT
I did some of the places you want to go to (Helsinki, Tallinn, Riga and Vilnius) in May and the weather was glorious. It was a bit on the coolish side (for me) but I know you prefer cooler weather to warmer. My daughter went to Iceland in September and loved it. She said the weather was brisk but beautiful.
|
|
|
Post by JoeP on Jan 11, 2021 21:25:38 GMT
I was astonished by southern Finland being 28-29°C in August, but that doesn't happen every year. I think you would probably be OK with most summer months.
October and November can be permanently grey, and before April things can still be frozen. You should definitely give some thought to seeing the area in February ... but the cruises may not operate during months when they'd need icebreakers ...
I don't know why you're asking me and Miisa though. You've explicitly excluded Finland. And, in fact, Iceland. :glare:
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 11, 2021 22:09:48 GMT
JoeP...Please reread my whole post. I believe I mentioned Helsinki several times and Finland at least once. One of my conundrums with the 'packages' I'm looking at is that one set includes Helsinki as one anchor of the 'Baltics' tour, but no Swedish stops, while the tour with Swedish stops entirely avoids Finland.
Finland is one edge of the area I am interested in. In terms of seasonal averages and typical climatic patterns for the area I'm most interested in visiting, you seem most likely. Claudia should be a good source, but I get the impression she is more inland. (Checking says nope....Bremen is the other side of Jutland; on the North Sea, not the Baltic.)
Also...What island is Reykjavik on?
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 11, 2021 22:12:52 GMT
Thanks, Kye. May sounds great. Was that on peak, or shoulder?
|
|
|
Post by Kye on Jan 11, 2021 22:44:10 GMT
Certainly not in high tourist season --I guess that's what's meant by "shoulder"?
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 11, 2021 23:29:14 GMT
Yes. Typically, there is a peak season for most destinations. It varies depending upon the destination type, of course.
The 'shoulders' are the periods prior to, and immediately following, the peak season. It used to be that the child-free traveled a lot during shoulder seasons to avoid the crowds of children at many destinations. Shoulders work for me because they tend to be less expensive and during climatically 'cooler' time periods. I loved it in Wales in April and Scotland in May.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Jan 11, 2021 23:56:25 GMT
I wouldn't go during the cold months .. right now, I am fantasising about tropical islands . I gather Helsinki in winter can be seriously brutal for those not used to it. And their winter season can last .. a long time
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 12, 2021 1:57:47 GMT
Well, I was in St. Petersburg in early June. For what they called 'White Nights'.
I have no plans for doing any 'winter traveling' in northern Europe. That's for going to southerly locales, like Greece. Or, Malta. Or, Morocco.
|
|
|
Post by JoeP on Jan 12, 2021 12:09:34 GMT
JoeP...Please reread my whole post. I believe I mentioned Helsinki several times and Finland at least once. One of my conundrums with the 'packages' I'm looking at is that one set includes Helsinki as one anchor of the 'Baltics' tour, but no Swedish stops, while the tour with Swedish stops entirely avoids Finland. Finland is one edge of the area I am interested in. In terms of seasonal averages and typical climatic patterns for the area I'm most interested in visiting, you seem most likely. Claudia should be a good source, but I get the impression she is more inland. (Checking says nope....Bremen is the other side of Jutland; on the North Sea, not the Baltic.) Also...What island is Reykjavik on? whollygoats ... please re-read your thread title I was making a possibly snarky technical point. Iceland and Finland are not part of Scandinavia - they are part of the wider Nordic area. Finland isn't one of the Baltic states either. I thought you would know this stuff!
|
|
|
Post by Kye on Jan 12, 2021 12:54:15 GMT
POSSIBLY snarky...?
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 12, 2021 14:16:06 GMT
You only got as far as the thread title?
Oh...Finland is not part of Scandinavia? Nor the Baltics? It's part of Russia, then?
Well, then....I can just ignore it then. Nothin' happenin' there.
And, I'd say we need to inquire with some Icelanders and see if they think they are part of Scandinavia.
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 13, 2021 19:39:24 GMT
Okay...I've given it some thought, and I think that JoeP may have a point.
I should have titled my thread:
"Old Man's Dream: All those places sorta near Finland. But, maybe, maybe not, Finland"
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Jan 13, 2021 19:45:14 GMT
When one goes to Finland, does one stand around reveling in the unscandivanianess of it all? Are the Finns sashaying around being pointedly nonscandinavian? Will there be great artworks of unscandivianess? Obviously, from these conversations, I have underestimated the feeling of native Finns about descandianavating their society. Are there angry mobs of antiscandinavians roaming the muskegs and quagmires of Finland?
I also understood that a small portion of Finnish citizens are native speakers of Swedish. I guess this augurs against Scandianvian influence, too? Or, are the Swedish speakers in Finland also NOT Scandinavians?
|
|
|
Post by JoeP on Jan 14, 2021 10:27:34 GMT
I'll admit, the non-Scandinavianness of Finland is not a topic of everyday conversation for most Finns.
But not being Swedish and not being Russian are extremely important, because of the history of having been ruled by Sweden or Russia in different centuries, and the long struggle for national identity and independence. The Finnish language is a distinct identity, having different roots from the Indo-European languages - shared only with neighbouring Estonian, Karelian and some others with even fewer speakers ... and Hungarian, according to the linguists.
But the Finnish territory, even the Swedish speaking areas (about 5% of the country, mostly south-western coastal), are still 100% Finland and not Sweden and not Scandinavia. Swedish-speaking Finns are very definitely Finns and not Swedes, and will tell you this. Yes, they speak Swedish because of the centuries of Swedish rule, but they aren't Swedish. I don't think it's as extreme as Afrikaners in South Africa who seem to claim that Dutch is a completely unrelated language - instead of being basically just a dialect. I think that Finland-Swedish has some distinct vocabulary and accents, so that a native could tell the difference between a recent immigrant Swede and a Swedish-speaking Finn, but this is way beyond my abilities.
|
|
|
Post by Mari on Jan 15, 2021 12:31:49 GMT
May and early June are good times for Berlin. I suppose it would work for more northern places as well. I'd love to visit Norway and Denmark, but somehow Sweden and Finland don't really interest me. I hope you find a nice trip.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Jan 15, 2021 21:35:08 GMT
I visited Finland in late June and so did all the mosquitoes (it being covered in thousands of lakes).
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Feb 22, 2021 13:50:42 GMT
I visited Finland in late June and so did all the mosquitoes (it being covered in thousands of lakes). Heh...Yeah, I'd figured that out already. Finland is like our Minnesota...or Alaska. Shiploads of tiny glacial lakes far from any vector control service. But then, if Finland isn't part of Scandinavia, nor of the Baltics, why would anyone even want to go there?
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Feb 22, 2021 13:54:34 GMT
"Why would anyone even want to go there?" - to visit Lapland, the home of Father Christmas
|
|
|
Post by whollygoats on Feb 22, 2021 15:34:36 GMT
"Why would anyone even want to go there?" - to visit Lapland, the home of Father Christmas Heh...Have you seen " Rare Exports"? A fun little 'holiday' film from Finland.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Feb 22, 2021 16:57:35 GMT
Heh...Have you seen " Rare Exports"? A fun little 'holiday' film from Finland. Lovely
|
|