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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2013 8:43:21 GMT
youtu.be/hniEcNgnlOwI don't know how to put YouTube videos on here, so I just have the link. This has been causing a bit of an uproar in Bremen and Germany. Seven policemen displayed extreme violence against one man when he was already down and unable to do anything. Apparently, they tried to make the video disappear afterwards. Am still looking for a better article in English. www.infowars.com/video-police-pulverize-suspect-like-a-pinata/
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Post by Alvamiga on Jul 13, 2013 9:20:48 GMT
Have the officers views been expressed anywhere here so any official statement made? The report is typical of the anti-police bias prevalent in many places. I didn't see anything in that video clip of them "pulverising him like a piñata" you can't even see how much the man must have been fighting against them to need that many officers to even try to hold him still. I have seen some instances in this country before where suspects fight viciously, just because the police are trying to detain, let alone arrest, them. In one instance, a man about to be caught with a significant stash of drugs fought off five police officers and nearly killed one with a punch to the face that broke his nose and half his eye socket. If suspects look like they are going for something in their pockets or a concealed weapon, the police only have fractions of a second to do something about it and they have to contain the person so the situation can be evaluated, or it could cost them their lives in the wrong situation. You don't wait until you see a knife, gun or whatever in that position! I am not saying they they didn't use excessive force, just that that video is insufficient for people to be making these sweeping judgements about what happened. I totally agree that there have been very clear cuts of brutality, such as the Rodney King beating in 1991. In the video, you have a very clear view of the victim and what is going on around him. There was no question that he was unable to defend himself and posed no threat to the officers. I don't mind people reporting on incidents that have actually happened, but I do hate trial by media!
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Post by tangent on Jul 13, 2013 9:29:49 GMT
Police brutality is always shocking to watch on video but it goes on around the world. One can only hope that, with the evidence of video recording, police behave decently and professionally in the way they have been trained.
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Post by ProdigalAlan on Jul 13, 2013 9:49:12 GMT
Nobody in their right mind w old condone police violence. OTOH I'm always reminded of the words of George Orwell to the effect that in order for people to sleep in their beds at night it is necessary that we are guarded by ruffians whom we pay to do those things we are not prepared to do.
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Post by Alvamiga on Jul 13, 2013 10:20:18 GMT
That is very true. I certainly would not want to be going daily against people of whom many will do pretty much anything to evade capture. People so often condone the level of force used by the police, but when I see what is used against them, I do respect the need for it in many situations.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2013 10:44:38 GMT
Admittedly, the comments that went along with the video were over the top. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a proper article in English. The video we saw on TV showed the man shouting at the police and when one of the policemen touched him, he hit the hand touching him, but did not attack the officer himself.
I understand that the would handcuff the man, get him down on the floor. Hitting and kicking him was definitely not necessary, he was being held down by several men.
What caused a lot of confusion is what happened to the video. The manager of the club apparently gave it to the police a day later, the police says they only saw it when it was all over the news. It does seem to many like they have tried to make it disappear. The club was searched last week and the videocameras were taken.
Nobody is certain yet whether the police really tried to cover the whole thing up. Unfortunately, it isn't the first time things like that happened. We are getting the impression that, because they wear a uniform, they feel like they do not have to be quite as careful. People wearing uniforms have had a special place in Germany for a very long time, the uniform basically meant they were right and some of that mentality is still left. I can post a link to an article from the German newspaper, I just don't know if that helps. So far, the video is there and the way the police treated the man there is disproportionate to the danger that went out from him. What is still not clear yet is the question whether the police, or some of them, tried to make the evidence disappear.
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Post by Alvamiga on Jul 13, 2013 12:05:18 GMT
Hitting his hand is still attacking the officer. If someone hit your hand, you could potentially have them for assault. They couldn't simply claim "It was only her hand! I didn't attack her!" Once people lash out in any way, it is often standard practice to immobilise someone who hits an officer in any way. The problem is that when people have been in clubs, they are usually drunk, along with all the bravado, poor judgement and so on that that brings. I have seen many instances of it taking as many as six officers to contain someone struggling. It is much harder to restrain someone (especially without trying to injure them) than it looks. At one point, an officer is using a baton round the man's legs, but he is clearly trying to get them from under him so they can get him down, again common practice as people lying on the floor are easier to contain. I am also very suspicious when people claim that no-one knows where the video is, but the press seem to have copies!
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Post by tangent on Jul 13, 2013 12:56:49 GMT
Six officers could easily have handcuffed him in no time. I've seen one officer handcuff a man who was struggling in less than two seconds. It was clear from the video that they were in no hurry to do that. Whilst I agree some men might require six officers to subdue them, this man was clearly not one of them.
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Post by whollygoats on Jul 13, 2013 18:45:14 GMT
This seems to be a widespread problem with those authorized to 'keep the peace'. This picture: Is from my town, where the police officers in this picture kicked to death the unarmed homeless schizophrenic on the ground after a stop for 'urinating in public'. Six police officers kicked him repeatedly with steel toed boots, after he had been tackled by one officer which had broken three ribs. Despite grossly incriminating video of the event, the police officers were absolved by a local police oversight commission, but the federal Justice Department stepped in with an investigation which clearly stated that the police were using excessive force, hugely unnecessary and insensitive use of force, with the mentally ill. Of course, in the recent past, in my city, there have been three fatal police shootings of unarmed 'perpetrators'...one by two police bullets in the back. The police always claim that it seemed as though the perpetrators were armed. They are clearly operating on the "shoot first, ask questions later" protocol. I, personally, am disgusted and sickened by the actions of the public police officers. And believe me, my elected officials know that.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2013 8:00:08 GMT
Six officers could easily have handcuffed him in no time. I've seen one officer handcuff a man who was struggling in less than two seconds. It was clear from the video that they were in no hurry to do that. Whilst I agree some men might require six officers to subdue them, this man was clearly not one of them. Aside from that one hit, he didn't appear to do much. And one policeman came up to him when he was down already and began to hit and kick him. There have been cases like that before and it scares me. Teachers or nurses in psychiatric hospitals have tough jobs as well and teachers are not even allowed to touch the pupils even though they can get very violent in some schools.
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Post by Alvamiga on Jul 14, 2013 8:40:32 GMT
Aside from that video, has the individual involved in this case actually reported being injured or anything tangible happened? Again, I have seen this kind of incident where someone is trying to punch and kick the police with any free limb they can get but, once they have sobered up and had time to calm down, they are totally fine.
I would at least want to see the full video, without the hefty cuts in it before I made any judgement on what was going on. There's clearly far more to see than was shown.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2013 12:13:02 GMT
Aside from that video, has the individual involved in this case actually reported being injured or anything tangible happened? Badly bruised ribs, he had to be taken to hospital right away because they did not know how bad it was (I know from personal experience that bruised ribs can feel like broken ribs at first).
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Post by tangent on Jul 14, 2013 21:31:29 GMT
In the UK, there are a number of fly-on-the-wall TV programmes in which police officers investigate minor crimes, usually involving ropey cars. At times, it is scary to see how easily a police officer can handcuff a burly young man in a couple of seconds, even when he is quite stroppy. It is quite obvious that these police officers had no intention of doing that until they had beaten up the man.
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Post by Mari on Jul 15, 2013 8:56:45 GMT
Tangent, you say that, but I watch those same shows and quite often it does take 6 officers to contain one man. Especially if that one person refuses to do as he is told.
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