|
Post by Moose on Mar 18, 2016 21:36:26 GMT
Or however the hell you spell his first name (what I typed does not look right). I've always loathed the man and it's probably too much to hope that he may be developing a social conscience. Maybe he senses that Osbourne and Cameron are on a sinking ship and wants to get off before he gets taken down with them
Iain? Iaain? Hmm, the first one looks like it might be right.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 18, 2016 22:09:33 GMT
Iain.
|
|
|
Post by juju on Mar 18, 2016 23:12:05 GMT
Good riddance. Totally cynical about the whole thing - rats leaving a sinking ship.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 19, 2016 0:01:10 GMT
Yes. I was deeply amazed to see that he thought the recent cuts were wrong. He's never shown any sign of that before, and he was right behind ATOS.
|
|
|
Post by juju on Mar 19, 2016 7:53:16 GMT
There'll be some ulterior motive, you can be sure. He's clearly realised the majority of public opinion is against it and wants to distance himself. Universal credit is a shambles, and I believe the UN are looking into the welfare cuts as a human rights violation, so I don't suppose he'll come out of that looking too good.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 19, 2016 9:21:27 GMT
This government wants to repeal the human rights act so it isn't fettered by rules that stop them doing what they want. Withdrawing from the EU just gives them an even stronger hand to shackle the electorate.
|
|
|
Post by JoeP on Mar 19, 2016 10:40:28 GMT
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 19, 2016 14:52:41 GMT
The Guardian editor doesn't mince his or her words.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 19, 2016 21:40:28 GMT
Wonder if he's banking on the vote being for Out. Which I don't personally think that it will be. If it is, though, that's probably the end of Cameron.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 20, 2016 1:18:33 GMT
If the referendum doesn't split the country it will certainly split the Conservative party.
|
|
|
Post by ProdigalAlan on Mar 20, 2016 17:32:21 GMT
Yes - very nice.
Except that the interview he gave to Andrew Marr this morning make it absolutely and unambiguously clear that this is a decision made on principle and principle alone.
Dontcha just wish that Labour and it's supporters knew what they were, let alone take some on board ?
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 19:43:18 GMT
Are you suggesting that we are less principled than IDS? And he was hardly likely to tell Marr that he left for anything other than principled reasons, was he?
|
|
|
Post by ProdigalAlan on Mar 20, 2016 20:19:23 GMT
Well he absolutely ruled out any other reason.
To be honest I'm getting utterly sick of the intolerance shown around here to Conservatives
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 20:27:23 GMT
Well no-one is forcing you to be here. But I am not going to apologise for really distrusting IDS.
|
|
|
Post by juju on Mar 20, 2016 20:54:17 GMT
Nor me. And to be honest,he hasn't done the Conservatives much good, has he? I'm surprised you're defending him.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 21:01:53 GMT
The thing is, why would IDS's conscience suddenly start to trouble him NOW? He's never shown any sign of giving a damn about the 'working poor' or the sick and disabled before, at least not that i have seen. He could have resigned during the fiasco that was ATOS and he did not. The timing, just before the referendum, seems just too .. convenient.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 20, 2016 22:00:31 GMT
The opinions expressed on EF in the past few days seem to me to be very similar to many of those expressed on Newsnight, by the BBC's political editor, Laura Kuenssberg, and in the Guardian and the Independent. I don't think anyone but a die-hard Conservative could put a gloss on anything that's happened in the past few days.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 22:07:37 GMT
To be totally fair, none of the above named are exactly what I'd call politically neutral
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 20, 2016 22:15:47 GMT
I'm not saying they are but they are fair-minded people/organisations. (I would never say that about the Daily Mail.)
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 22:21:43 GMT
The Mail is being quite vitriolic too which is odd as it's generally very pro Brexit.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 20, 2016 22:44:23 GMT
The Mail is being quite vitriolic too which is odd as it's generally very pro Brexit. Whatever sells most copies.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 22:51:10 GMT
One thing I have noticed is that the DM comments section is dominated by people who dislike the Tories - at least Cameron - and are very pro-Ukip.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 20, 2016 23:17:12 GMT
Maybe it's the Trump phenomenon, post outrageous sensational stories and you get a following of angry young men.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 20, 2016 23:38:05 GMT
I do not think that most UKIP supporters are young.
|
|
|
Post by juju on Mar 21, 2016 7:31:32 GMT
To be honest I'm getting utterly sick of the intolerance shown around here to Conservatives We're all intelligent people here, capable of making up our own minds. We speak as we find, is all.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 30, 2016 1:57:12 GMT
Quite. I also don't really like to feel that i can't say anything on here without being accused of bigotry.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 30, 2016 6:57:21 GMT
I'm getting a slightly different view of Iain Duncan Smith from the one that is popular. He is a highly principled man who has a passion, not for saving money but for breaking the mould that causes benefit dependency, thereby leading to a better life for individuals who are capable of work. This would explain his great joy on hearing John Osborne announce a rise in the minimum wage in the Commons. I heard somewhere that his benefit changes haven't made any money for the treasury, and I don't think he cares. On the other hand, his changes have had a devastatingly cruel effect on huge numbers of disabled people and the methods his department has used have been monstrous. It's hard to reconcile these failures with a highly principled man. So I think IDS is actually two people, Ian Smith and Duncan Smith, twin brothers. Ian is the caring, compassionate reformer whilst Duncan is his evil twin.
|
|
|
Post by Moose on Mar 31, 2016 1:18:05 GMT
Ask your loved ones how they would feel if they had their disability benefits stripped from them. IDS did not give a toss when that was happening.
|
|
|
Post by tangent on Mar 31, 2016 2:06:04 GMT
That's why I say they are twin brothers.
|
|